LGB Falling Short (including AI)
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You could also try to manually lase the target from time of release to impact…
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Greetings,
what was your distance from the target?
I had bombs falling short because I dropped them too far away and they might have run out of energy while steering towards the target. -
What AC and type LGB did you use? And give target name.
Tavor
Ac type: F-16C-40-IAF, GBU10 (var?), Suez North Bridge E2.I will try to manually lase the target in the future, Badger.
Staggolee, I was dropping CCRP…wouldn’t the LGBs only release when pickled if the launch parameters were met for alt/range/speed, etc.? I flew directly over the target since the autopilot was heading to that STPT.
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In CCRP, they will only drop when they have met launch parameters. In CCRP, the design idea is that you pickle and hold from outside the effective range, and the bomb drops when it gets in range - but you take your thumb off the pickle if you no longer consent to release.
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Ac type: F-16C-40-IAF, GBU10 (var?)…
OK! F-16D-40-IAF hit Suez North Bridge E2 with 2 GBU10 without problems. Dont forget to put LASER in CMBT mode by ICP + DED !!!
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i bet this is the problem. Forgetting the laser is in training mode. I have missed so many times because of the default setting. Wish there was a way to make this not the default
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Have Lockheed change it in the real jet
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Have Lockheed change it in the real jet
It can be part of a DTE load in the real jet, I think.
EDIT: on checking, I am mistaken in this
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Tavor
Ac type: F-16C-40-IAF, GBU10 (var?), Suez North Bridge E2.I will try to manually lase the target in the future, Badger.
Staggolee, I was dropping CCRP…wouldn’t the LGBs only release when pickled if the launch parameters were met for alt/range/speed, etc.? I flew directly over the target since the autopilot was heading to that STPT.
It was a D variant. Sorry.
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i bet this is the problem. Forgetting the laser is in training mode. I have missed so many times because of the default setting. Wish there was a way to make this not the default
Nope. Was in combat mode. Triple checked.
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It can be part of a DTE load in the real jet, I think.
That’s news to me. Any documentation for that?
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I suspect I am mistaken, had a look in the double sticks and found nothing. My bad!
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You may be lazing the target too soon. The LGB releases under CCRP conditions which means it will carry forward momentum towards the target while falling, following an arc enroute to target. Lazing too early or even from time of release will cause the weapon to point and fly towards the target…giving it a direct trajectory to the target and the bomb will fall short due to this effect. Try a shorter laze time…the default time usually works very well…I think it’s set at 8 seconds.
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That should only be an issue for older LGBs.
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Hi all.
After several campaign missions and some training missions created by myself for testing, I’ve also experienced LGB always falling short off the target in this setup:
Theater: Israel
Weather: Sunny / Fair
Aircraft: F-16 MLU
TGP: Sniper
Weapon: GBU-12
Launch mode: CCRP level (not toss)
Ripple: single / pairWhen pickle button is hold in advance for level drop (not toss) and GBU are launched at computed max range, they ALWAYS fall short. All required launching parameters are met (height, speed, combat laser, laser code, TGP line of sight, laser time, and so on, everything is double checked and is OK) . The only workaround that I found is no to pickle at max range, but wait a few seconds and launch a little later. Changing heading approach to the target to take upwind / downwind into account does not help, the results are the same: fall short.
Regards,
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Hi all.
After several campaign missions and some training missions created by myself for testing, I’ve also experienced LGB always falling short off the target in this setup:
Theater: Israel
Weather: Sunny / Fair
Aircraft: F-16 MLU
TGP: Sniper
Weapon: GBU-12
Launch mode: CCRP level (not toss)
Ripple: single / pairWhen pickle button is hold in advance for level drop (not toss) and GBU are launched at computed max range, they ALWAYS fall short. All required launching parameters are met (height, speed, combat laser, laser code, TGP line of sight, laser time, and so on, everything is double checked and is OK) . The only workaround that I found is no to pickle at max range, but wait a few seconds and launch a little later. Changing heading approach to the target to take upwind / downwind into account does not help, the results are the same: fall short.
Regards,
Hi, please post the TE you used for testing this, thanx.
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It was a campaign mission.
Yea I know, that’s why I posted for Caldero and not you
Guys, if you will let me explain the conflict here and the delicate story of LGBs.
In 4.33 I worked mainly on Avionics and mainly A-G stuff, now during development of avionics I played a LOT with LGBs and JDAMs, and noticed a couple of things which bothered me a lot:
1. LGBs before 4.33 (Since ever in Falcon) were a joke because practically you could drop a LGB, then while the bomb is airborne, you could move the laser spot around and your bomb will “kick” to the new target point, I remember moving a LGB this way ~20NM a head of the original target position - Now LGBs are energy bounded, you can try to compare if you have still have 4.32 installed.
2. JDAMs used to be “kicked” abruptly when they were dropped inside envelope but at weird angles, e.g when target was right or left - Now JDAMs “dropped smoothly” and while they still do funny things like accelerating right/left/backward/forward, they do it much more smoothly and slowly than the abrupt “kicking” of 4.32 and before.
3. Lofting JDAMs from low altitude had incredible range, ~2 times more than RL - Now it is still higher than RL, but MUCH closer than what it was (it was in 4.32 ~11.5NM, now it’s more like ~7NM)
4. There was no practical difference between LGB II and LGB III - Now there is some difference in range and in gliding pattern.
So as described above, I had to kind of rewrite the guided bombs behavior. Now don’t know if you know or not, the main problem with implementation of bombs in Falcon is that they have no FMs and they are only move by the bombs code, now while that kinda worked since ever for LGBs II (besides point I mentioned in 1, which probably was a bug in Falcon since day 1…), it became more and more problematic for LGB III and JDAMs. So I had to play, and play and play again and again and again, and as my aerodynamics knowledge isn’t that great, I just did the best I could with the code to find the “golden path”, and that’s what we have today.
Now that said, I did a LOT of testing and small fixes and adjustments in order to get it right, but still it could be that at some edge cases you may see them missing, that’s why I said that I want a reproduction case so I can try it myself and see where is the problem.
The ultimate solution for LGBs/JDAMs is eventually to turn these bombs in the DB into missile objects and give them a proper FM for correct gliding & lofting, I hope that will happen someday but I can’t do it myself as I need someone that understands aerodynamics much better than me.
Cheers!