for Quest 3 users : passthrough screen readability (helios compositing)
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@Korbi @Mikyjax yes BMS has made it clear in a few posts that a MR cockpit is in the world plus OpenXR support, so this is exciting and something to my knowledge will be a bit of a first on combat sims.
But yes, passthrough quality will be important for this. However, it both comes down to passthrough cameras and VR display quality. I own the Quest 2, Reverb G2, and Pimax Crystal right now. I would point out that if your MFDs are not clear enough for your liking in the 3d cockpit of your VR headset, the passthrough by definition can’t be any clearer than that and possibly worse. Looking at the numbers, the Quest 3 should be clearer than the G2 with slightly higher PPD and better lenses. The Quest 3 passthrough cameras are 4MP (about 1440p) with mixed reviews on clarity with it apparently being light sensitive. So whether or not you’ll get the readability of your Helios monitor to be satisfied is a little unknown and unfortunately not 100% knowable until you try.
VR MFD readability is highly subjective and personal. The Quest 2 was just barely usable to me and need look ubder, G2 is where it’s was just nice to have look under with my facial interface mod that you are both familiar with. The Crystal is where I don’t feel like I ever need look under for MFD readability, just finding switches in my home cockpit would be nice for the mod. But I haven’t modded its facial interface yet because there isn’t any available to buy but I’m in far less of a hurry with it too than before with it’s clarity.
Also if OpenXR gets PointCTRL working with BMS, I will only need a few select physical switches that I need to reach without looking anymore, like Master Arm and gear handle. It truly made me feel like I didn’t need all but those select few by touch switches in any VR cockpit in DCS.
Also I’m not up on the current MR support, I know there is MR games available for the Quest and you can do the knock on the headset to activate passthrough and BMS is cooking in some kind of support too. But what you really will want is it supported that when you lower your head so much the passthrough will automatically activate. Knocking on the headset to turn on/off passthrough will be too slow and awkward. I know that exists support in OpenXR, but not sure whose the added layer of Oculus software will effect it.
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The Q3 camera is pretty decent with backlit cockpit stuff in a semi dark room. In my testing I can toggle between pass through and 3d and see the buttons but the toggling back and forth is not instant so I still find it a bit annoying.
I’m starting to learn by muscle memory where stuff is and it’s going pretty well but it’s still hard.
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@b0bl00i Thank you, are you able to make a little through the lens video? Maybe with the Quest positioned where your head is normally and then let the Quest film MFDs and Panels for readability etc. ?
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@Korbi I’ll try! There is another way and that is by adjusting the face mask further away from the lenses. That makes it possible to look down and see the cockpit underneath. It lowers the Fov though.
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@b0bl00i Thank you, looking forward to!
Looking beneath the headset is not the goal I think. -
Hello guys, thanks for all your answers.
@b0bl00i if you ctrl-click on the first picture of my very first post it will open the picture in a new tab. Then click again with the magnifying glass on the left MFD so it’s 100% resolution.
Activate the passtrough on your quest 3, put yourself at around 50 cm from the picture on the screen.
Can you read the bracket bullseye on the mfd (178_118)? can you read the QNH indicator on the altimeter (1010)?
Those two are the smallest informations.
When you look around that picture, are there indications that are hard to read? Does it feel confortable? Is there a lot of distorsion?
Thank you for this test.
Mike -
@Mikyjax said in for Quest 3 users : passthrough screen readability (helios compositing):
Can you read the bracket bullseye on the mfd (178_118)? can you read the QNH indicator on the altimeter (1010)?
With some difficulty, light in my room is low.
Here you have the in-headset screenshot. Sorry for the resolution, but it seems that Quest3 captures are 1024x1024 only
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@oleuzop Big thanks for your time.
it does look decent. I will order one.Thank you!
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@Mikyjax Welcome! It’s a nice headset
I still like more Pico4 (it’s more comfortable out of the box) but you can get the elite head strap and it should be quite comfortable too
For passthrough Pico4 is not bad, but quest 3 wins
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Playing BMS in AR with the Quest 3 is nuts!
I got it today and just ran a few tests, no need to repaint the texture of the cockpit, we can use this tool:
https://store.steampowered.com/app/1844610/Reality_Mixer__Mixed_Reality_for_VR_headsets/
That will let you draw a box to which you assign a color (pink in my case)
Then virtual desktop does replace it by your camera.
You can see some artefacts in the video and it’s mainly due to the recording. (I do see some pink around my screen but the right edge deformation was not part of the VR experience)I need to play with it a bit more to adjust the screen position and the box so it’s a bit less uggly but it’s really functionnal… No more mouse or keyboard needed, it’s a blast.
Just keep in mind that information receive by Helios is not laggy on my screen, it becomes laggy once virtual desktop does the compositing (I might be able to tweak it but honnestly, since I can show/hide my screen in game I prefer to use the game MFD) It’s now perfectly readable with the Quest 3
Some time will be needed to test it properly and tweak some stuffs but man it’s fun.
No need to wait a couple more months
Thanks,
Mike -
@Mikyjax That is a really interesting concept. Speaks more to how to interact with the buttons and switches all in one place rather than twisting and turning around in VR to interact.
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@Mikyjax Nice concept! It’s the poor man’s physical cockpit
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Have to say, as a Varjo Aero user, I am quite impressed with the Quest 3’s mixed reality possibilities for those of us with physical MFDs/ICPs/etc… Saw the BMS video, then
explaining how to set it up, has me thinking about it. Just being to easily see the KB would be a great help! -
@Icer yes this is exactly how I’ve done it in my demo.
- Virtual desktop should be able to use any camera to achieve that effect so I guess, soon, even people without passthrough on their VR headset will be able to just stick a cam (or 2) on there headset and have even better result than with the quest 3 cameras.
I can’t wait to see how BMS team will streamline this since all there is to do to remove the VRmixer step is to add a pink polygon fixed above the cockpit, that will guarantee the perfect position all the time, and no latency, not like VR mixer which cannot be perfectly sync with the BMS view.
Exciting times to be a simmer…
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@MaxWaldorf weeks please
Just joking…take your time…we just cannot wait for 4.38 -
@Virus that right now slated for 4.37.4 with its addition of OpenXR allowing AR. That is coming which is hoped to be Q1 of 2024.
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@Snake122 said in for Quest 3 users : passthrough screen readability (helios compositing):
@Virus that right now slated for 4.37.4 with its addition of OpenXR allowing AR. That is coming which is hoped to be Q1 of 2024.
You guys are legitimately smashing it out of the park.
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Mike,
Awesome job, can you share your helios setup. I have 2 screens, but the vr displays on 1st and 2nd monitors(mirrors) and I don’t get the view port displays on the cockpit. Plus it’s really shudders when I move my head. I have a 4090 and top tier pc. I just started vr , so not familiar as much as I want to be. Thanks.
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@scottd5800 Hello,
I’m using Ice’s profile you can find here :
https://forum.falcon-bms.com/topic/20238/ice-s-falcon-bms-profile-updated-for-bms-4-37You can’t be in Mirror mode, you need to right click on your desktop >display settings and choose extend this screen instead of mirror.
Be sure to read Max’s post for a few VR improvement:
https://forum.falcon-bms.com/topic/23871/couple-notes-to-vr-usersAs a note, this “solution” requires one more layer “VR Reality mixer” that’s a payware and as Max said above to me we won’t need that software for U4.
I would suggest you to try to get your vr setup smooth first, then have it smooth with helios running and only then try the mixed reality stuff. It takes time to optimize VR and I’m nowhere near close to the performance I want so I can’t help on that part. -
@Mikyjax Thanks. I have reality mixer and can get passthrough. Silky smooth without reality mixer running, with running, slight jittery when moving my head, seems not to like it as much.
On helios, I use it all the time and quite familiar. For some reason in vr , the view ports don’t display ,.because normally background is black and view ports populate. I get the monitor background without viewports, I also get telemetry, a little laggy. If I use the it , non vr, everything works great. Not sure if I missed a step? Thanks and that’s my goal to get what you accomplished. This is my first time vr, wow I can’t go back! So realistic!
I have RTX 4090, and very beefy PC…so i can achieve extremely high settings with super smooth visuals,.it’s the reality mixer layer that adds the micro stutters, when moving head only.
I just got to figure why my helios is not showing viewports (yes, I don’t have the 2 monitors mirror, I have them extended mode)
Thanks for any ideas or suggestions I might have missed.