4.37 VR cockpit scale feels off
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@chihirobelmo
That is a great idea Chihi!
Thank you for all your effort.
I also can confirm the report for the F-16 cockpit. I have a 1:1 replica cockpit for BMS with a lot of original parts, so I have a very good feeling for scale of sitting in the F-16 cockpit for myself and in VR it is definitely to small. Seating and head positions are correct though.
Keep up your great work! -
Ferde said: …when I looked down I saw the pilot legs slightly above my real bellybutton.
If you are flying topless, remember to put the heater on.
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No way to solve it but do another pit…
I don’t think it is worth having the code for that…
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Indeed I had such an option in the code while developing VR but removed it as I thought forcing general logic should give everyone the correct scale…which was not,
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World scale slider as on dcs is way to go.
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@haukka81 said in 4.37 VR cockpit scale feels off:
World scale slider as on dcs is way to go.
It doesn’t act on cockpit only buy on the entire 3D world. So, if F-16 pit dimensions are confirmed wrong, only a new F-16 3D pit will be the solution. And it could be a good opportunity to make it better and add what is not working for now such as turn indicator or STBYADI cage button …
But priority seems to be on the F-15. -
Doesn’t MSFS OpenXR have the world scaling option? Idk if it does it to the whole world, but it certainly helps to adjust per HMD and plane.
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What is strange is that in nonVr it all feels OK. So maybe it’s not the cockpit itself but some other VR thing? Like some camera setting?
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The F-16 and F-18 are acceptable to me. (Pretty d*** great, actually!) But they are slightly off and some respects, as has been mentioned above. This is also true for me in other VR sims as well. What is hilariously off is the Harrier. I feel like I am 10 feet tall flying a jet designed for 10’ pilots.
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Hi guys,
yes, this is a known issue with every 3D game, especially with simulators, where the scaling is important. The adjustable IPD (Inter-Pupillary Distance) is the key. Possible the program can read out the IPD value from the VR googles, but that is usually wrong (this issue appeared with DCS VR and with Cliffs of Dover VR too).
Need two extra keyboard key for IPD increase and decrease and a new conf.ini line for changeable default value.
Changing the FOV is not the solution here, that do different thing, and not to mention changing the FOV will distort the perspective view too. VR zoom will be always weird, but that is OK, there is no better solution for that.
And obviously this is not a 3D model issue either, so nobody should touch anything 3D related.
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@VO101_Tom said in 4.37 VR cockpit scale feels off:
Hi guys,
yes, this is a known issue with every 3D game, especially with simulators, where the scaling is important. The adjustable IPD (Inter-Pupillary Distance) is the key. Possible the program can read out the IPD value from the VR googles, but that is usually wrong (this issue appeared with DCS VR and with Cliffs of Dover VR too).
Need two extra keyboard key for IPD increase and decrease and a new conf.ini line for changeable default value.
Changing the FOV is not the solution here, that do different thing, and not to mention changing the FOV will distort the perspective view too. VR zoom will be always weird, but that is OK, there is no better solution for that.
And obviously this is not a 3D model issue either, so nobody should touch anything 3D related.
Yes. Exactly. I remember being able to set scale in some app and felt the effect physically on the way my eyes behaved. Pretty much the same thing with MSFS2020 with its cockpit windows.
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@LorikEolmin Yepp, this is basically a vr goggle issue, the default IPD value is not suitable for everyone, and even if the lens distance changeable, and the IPD value can be read out from the goggles, many players reported that their custom settings is much better than the default settings.
Perhaps other programs use different name for the same settings, “world scaling” also correct, but the difference will be noticeable only in the cockpits anyway.
The good news that the fix is usually quick (I am not a coder though), but our coder in Cliffs’ came up with the solution very quickly.
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The viper pit in VR maybe is 90 percent my perceived actual size which is absolutely fine to me. I’m more curious what should be the distance between the MFDs and my head? Because in VR it looks like the MFDs are below the knees? Someone who sat in an actual cockpit might know?
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@spotdott I’ve sat in the real jet several times, and yes the MFDs are beyond your knees.
Pic to illustrate.
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@chihirobelmo said in 4.37 VR cockpit scale feels off:
Indeed I had such an option in the code while developing VR but removed it as I thought forcing general logic should give everyone the correct scale…which was not,
If you are looking at OpenXR/Open Composite integration the OpenXR Toolkit has the option for World Scale built in… You can change it on the fly, along with a LOT of other VR settings, love it.
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@SOBO-87 said in 4.37 VR cockpit scale feels off:
@spotdott I’ve sat in the real jet several times, and yes the MFDs are beyond your knees.
Pic to illustrate.
In 4.37 VR with Quest 2 see the MFDs just above my ankles, not my knees, and the pilot legs at the same height of my belly button
I think something is weird, not a showstopper (I love falcon in VR!) But I hope it can be fixed
Best regards
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Guys,
Just saying, I realized people saying the cockpit feels “small” that could be interpreted either way. To me with the Pimax 8k X having parallel projections checked, the cockpit feels “small” in the sense that everything is too close to me, making everything bigger than normal (ICP, HUD) but smaller distances involved. I didn’t realize that we could be describing the same thing, so please give a little bit more of a descriptor there if you could in more physical reference.
I would say from sitting in the real F-16 and cockpit trainer multiple times, it is one of the smaller fighter jets out there and everything feels tight, close, but accessable. The F-15 on the other hand has the reputation to feel very roomy and spacious like “an old Cadillac,” partly due to the nose diameter with it’s large radar dish. Unfortunately, this is one of those things that doesn’t always translate as well until you sit in them for real.
@Caldero said in 4.37 VR cockpit scale feels off:
@SOBO-87 said in 4.37 VR cockpit scale feels off:
@spotdott I’ve sat in the real jet several times, and yes the MFDs are beyond your knees.
Pic to illustrate.
In 4.37 VR with Quest 2 see the MFDs just above my ankles, not my knees, and the pilot legs at the same height of my belly button
I think something is weird, not a showstopper (I love falcon in VR!) But I hope it can be fixed
Best regards
Just saying, your actual body or the VR pilot body? It matters because RL F-16 seat is much different position than an office chair.
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@Snake122 I know you asked Caldero, but I started this thread so forgive my intrusion.
The VR legs are at the real world’s bellybutton level. It feels as if the pilot in BMS was petite. But is the overall cabin that feels a tad too small in scale.
Like the flight control looks smaller than the replica I have to control it.I don’t have that feeling in other VR simulations.
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@Snake122 Very good call!!
What I mean with small in that case is the opposite you have described.
Seatingposition and headposition feels correct and good, but the cockpit is pretty tiny. So every component is to small/to far away.The refference I use to compare the BMS cockpit in VR to is a very acurately built 1:1 homecockpit with a lot of real components, I’m sitting in dozens of hours per month.
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@Snake122 Hi, I think the root of this issue that the eye distance of the users are different, and the depth perception, the scale of the surrounding world is strongly connected to this exact distance. How their brain learned and used this view difference before. If you put a VR goggle on a user, and the two small display show them pictures generated from a different distance, your brain will process that pictures as a different scaling than usual. This is why you will get different opinions and different results if you ask the users, because everyone perceives their surroundings slightly differently, someone will see the 4.37 cockpits in perfect size, someone will feel smaller.
This is what the IPD (Inter-Pupillary Distance) settings intended to solve in all VR games (distance between the VR left and right camera viewpoints). This value should be changeable by users.
This is independent from camera center position, if someone feel that camera is not in the good position, lower or further back than it should, or how big the pilot model is. Then you will see the cockpit from a different spot, but the scaling would be still OK. The camera position will not affect the IPD issue at all.